SCOTT SIMON, HOST:
President Trump says that Beijing is violating the terms of the agreement to pause triple-digit tariffs that the U.S. and China reached just a couple of weeks ago. Is the trade war back on? NPR's Ron Elving joins us now. Ron, thanks for being with us.
RON ELVING, BYLINE: Good to be with you, Scott.
SIMON: The president made that claim all caps on a social media post yesterday, and that follows Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent's assessment on Thursday that trade talks with China were, quote, "a bit stalled." What happened to the administration's claim that there'd be 90 deals in 90 days?
ELVING: That was a promise or an aspiration, more than anything else. And now, as we approach the halfway point in those 90 days, it looks more like a pipe dream. We have seen a big new trade deal with Great Britain, big splashy announcement, details to follow someday. As for the rest of Europe, the European Union, those talks are, in Trump's own words, going nowhere. So he has threatened the EU with 50% tariffs on everything, which he then paused until July 9. Meanwhile, talks with China seem to have gone backwards, and it doesn't help that the U.S. now wants to revoke the visas for Chinese students going to school in the U.S. And all this has been complicated further by court decisions this week, saying Trump does not have the authority to impose all these tariffs without Congress. That ruling by the International Trade Court could cripple the whole anti-tariff campaign, but that, too, is on pause just now while a higher court reviews that ruling.
SIMON: Of course, there's, Ron, a program that allowed nearly half a million people from Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua and Venezuela to enter the U.S. and remain here legally for two years. Supreme Court said yesterday that the administration can halt this program, while a legal battle over the effort to end legal protections proceeds. What are the effect of this decision?
ELVING: Well, that program provided legal breathing room for refugees from just those four beleaguered countries. It began several years ago during an immigration surge during the Biden administration, and as you say, half a million people are now in this country depending on it. And this week, a divided Supreme Court said that, yes, Biden had the authority at that time to do this, but that his White House successor can also undo it. So for the moment, at least, these hundreds of thousands of residents are subject to deportation at any time, and their families and communities where they live are facing this enormous dislocation. And we know some Trump officials have been talking about doing up to 3,000 deportations a day, and this group could be part of that.
SIMON: There was a send-off for Elon Musk in the Oval Office yesterday at which President Trump said he's brought about colossal change, but added Elon's really not leaving. How do you read this?
ELVING: It's hard to take either of those statements at face value, but it does seem that both Trump and Musk want to have it both ways. They want to exploit each other's assets, but they are wary of the blowback their relationship has brought them both. They want to have Musk's aura of success, even though his $2 trillion in promised budget savings is now down to 160 billion at most. And that's less than a dime for every promised dollar. Yet they don't want the downside of the relationship. Neither man is known for sharing the limelight gladly. Also Musk's been quite openly distressed at the damage his government role has done to his various high-profile high-tech ventures. Lately, there's been some daylight between the two because Musk pointed out that Trump's mega-budget bill actually doesn't reduce the deficit, but rather adds trillions to the national debt.
SIMON: And of course, Ron, one of the most debated aspects of Musk's government service was that the cuts he and his team implemented didn't go through Congress, which authorized that spending in the first place. Now some DOGE cuts are headed to Capitol Hill, though, right?
ELVING: That's right, but just a very small fraction. He said he could cut 160 billion. Now we're expecting to see less than 10 coming to Congress as what's called a rescission bill. It rescinds spending commitments that, as you say, have already been made. So these rescissions barely dent the deficit, but they do eliminate certain programs that Trump and Musk say the government shouldn't be doing. That includes, for example, the U.S. Agency for International Development and the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, which supports PBS and NPR.
SIMON: NPR's senior contributor, Ron Elving. Ron, thanks so much.
ELVING: Thank you, Scott. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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